My first design job came after I'd already done some college textbook editing (a field unrelated to design or reality). I started at the bottom (salary: $24,500 in 1995) in the design department of a book publisher, but it got me in. I got free access to software, fonts, information. Starting at the bottom is not a bad thing, if you're young enough to live like that. You don't need experience so much as a demonstrable interest in the work, and a clear desire to work hard. All of which takes one interview to convey, with or without much of a portfolio per se.

Then, wanting to get into general graphic design, I went to Portfolio Center essentially as a career move. It was the most solid way I could see to avoid having to start at the bottom, which I did not want to do all over again. Generally, I think the fake projects one does in school are better than the fake projects you could give yourself, plus school actually makes you do them.

Then again, it depends. If you want to work for Pentagram, a school portfolio is probably the best way. If you want to work for yourself and just move from web to print (or vice versa), you probably don't need school--you just gotta scramble for any and all work and then start building up contacts, samples, and go from there. It can be done.

One thing I'd throw out there is this: if you are changing your work focus, don't expect a headhunter to do much with you. Not that headhunters have much work these days anyway, but what they do have is pretty specific, and they want to find people that fit a mold.

I've been trying to expand my breadth a little (not into web, mind you!), and while freelancing has been relatively successful at getting me some more varied work, the headhunters all say the same thing: we can get you branding jobs, otherwise, keep freelancing.

One of the reasons I wanted to get out of marchFIRST was that I didn't want to keep doing so much web. In my first job search I decided to downplay my web experience and focus on trying to get a print heavy job. That didn't work. I stoped looking for 5 months, beefed up my web skillz (notice the "z" and instead of the "s"), went around looking for both and hoping for the best. The ability to do both things is what got my resume past others, and my Mexican charm helped too. My point is... crap... I'm not sure what my point is.

Maybe that you have to be at the right place at the right time.

Do you go back to school? Make up some fake projects? Beg for a chance? Work at McDonald’s while you figure out what to do.?

Yes.

I think when you're younger you have both the stamina to believe you can do what you want to, and perhaps the lack of knoweledge about what you don't know.

Today, I find myself less likely to want to change careers completely as gaining credibility and experience takes time and dedication. Something which is helped massively, as Armin says, 'being in the right place in the right time'.

I have found that if you are truly passionate about moving into a new field, then pro bono work is one of the best ways to go. Getting projects that can help you learn and exposed to working with others in your 'new' chosen field, is difficult if you have to charge a fee to cover your cost of living. So, if you can supplement your current work with additional projects in the new career you want - then thats perhaps a good way.

Having never been to college, I have found it to take a lot of extra work on my behalf to gain the credibility and experience I've needed to do the work I want. Something that I have to pursue continuously.

But I've also found that collaborating with people that are experienced, in helping them out or doing projects together, gives me additional exposure to projects.

No one needs to know the work was done for free - unless you're trying to start a firm with staff - the measure of your abilities will largely be based on what you've previously completed and what you say you can do at that time.

I did eventually try to get myself hired by a large design firm so that I could continue to learn and make mistakes at someone elses expense rather than my own.

A long time ago, I once managed to get four clients to retain my services for web design, without having shown them a previous piece of work that I had done. Unfortunately, that was both at a time when to be able to speak about the web confidently was unique and my inexperience didn't make me cautious about what I was doing. Being only part Mexican - and living in England, I'm afraid I can't credit them genes.

Do you go back to school? Make up some fake projects? Beg for a chance? Work at McDonald’s while you figure out what to do.?

Definitely make up some fake projects. When you finished school did you really have any "real" projects to show?

Don't call them 'fake' though...call them 'proposed' or 'concepts' etc.

Or, find some interesting business that you think could benefit from a real makeover. Design whatever kind of materials you'd like, and then you can claim that as a proposed solution for a real company (not "client", though).

As a bonus, you could then approach the company and say something like 'I'm really impressed with your company and I took the time to come up with some ideas that I would like to show you if you are interested.'

I wouldn't push the issue, but someone may be impressed enough to pay for it.

Of course, this is all considered spec work, and that has its own stigma...but no one needs to know... ;o)

>Don't call them 'fake' though...call them 'proposed' or 'concepts' etc.

This might be off-topic but how well received is concept "work"?

I had a lot of it coming out of marchFIRST and I had mixed reactions, some didn't care, others did say that it was quite a bit of concept work. I think on it's positive side it can show what solutions you can give to varied clients and projects, but then again how come it didn't get chosen... and "the client is stupid and has no clue about what good design is" doesn't count as a valid reason.

Just wondering.

On the one hand - any concepts that didn't make it to the final stage of design and implementation essentially didn't work. the use of 'work' there is to mean, that they didn't meet the scope of requirements set out by the process of design.

However, on the other hand - you could argue that the client was stupid and therefore some of your best designs have been disregarded. But that will always reflect negatively on you if you were unable to follow a process where the best concept of design was chosen.

And then there's the real world - where working in large teams, your work is simply disregarded even before the client gets to see it for a whole number of reasons.

If you show a wide variety of design concepts that were never implemented or chosen, then you cannot argue that they worked, or were usable or communicated their message clearly - as they were never used or fullfilled their function of design. At best, they just show your ability to execute design concepts to a certain standard of quality.

However - if you've never had any clients, then it is possible that it is your only option.

that they didn't meet the scope of requirements set out by the process of design.

if you were unable to follow a process where the best concept of design was chosen

Simply because a concept or design (and I'll state, for this matter, I'm referring to graphics!) doesn't get produced does not, in my book, mean that it is a failed piece of design. The process may have been followed quite perfectly, but the client may not be prepared to accept the best solution.

Armin, your dilemma is shared by any designer coming out of a firm with several design teams and many designers. There are different ways to solve the problem correctly. There could be 2 designs that are great, but the client likes the blue scheme over the orange one. I had a project where I solved the brief typographically (it was an identity) and another designer solved it with a mark. The brief never spelled out which the client preferred; they probably didn't know they had a preference until it was presented to them. They chose the mark. Is my type solution wrong? Nope. And it's in my portfolio.

If switching from web to print one thing to consider is learning how to print for yourself: something like silk screening , bookbinding, or letterpress that could be done at home and is relatively cheap.

While it may or may not lead to pieces that are worth showing an employer I think it provides an opportunity to understand how type is set, how ink is put down, what paper can and can't do...fundamentals that can translate to screen and to thinking about larger jobs.

Also, before spending a ton of time making up fake clients it might be best to treat yourself as your first client in the direction that you want to head. If moving to print: design and print cards and stationary.....if moving to the web: design a portfolio site for yourself. Ultimately, those are things that you will have to do and will be the first thing your next employer sees.

Simply because a concept or design (and I'll state, for this matter, I'm referring to graphics!) doesn't get produced does not, in my book, mean that it is a failed piece of design.

Right. It just means that you and/or your company failed in selling that solution to the client. Sometimes you're just 'the designer' and you have no control over what the VP or account exec ends up selling the client.

but the client may not be prepared to accept the best solution.

Or, rather, the firm wasn't prepared to sell the best solution. But, like I said, this may or may not be a reflection on the graphic designer's sales ability.

There are different ways to solve the problem correctly.

And that is probably the most valid argument for showing un-chosen work. You can certainly have more than one 'right' solution.

>Right. It just means that you and/or your company failed in selling that solution to the client. Sometimes you're just 'the designer' and you have no control over what the VP or account exec ends up selling the client.

I don't think it's solely a reflection of the ability to sell. You never know what's going on inside a client's head. Like Jon said, the client might have a subjective preference towards the red concept instead of the blue concept and no matter how you present the concept the red will be chosen. Which goes back to our subjective/objective discussion about design.

Actually, I'm about to go back to school! (hopefully)

I started out in the web field at a very young age (17), being fascinated by interactive design/video. I've done lot's of fun things such as co-writing a book, making wacky video stuff, doing some really fun client work etc..

It's 4 years later now, and I've become more and more frustrated with myself, not knowing enough about the history of design, and the actual meaning behind design. I'm kinda ashamed of not knowing the fundamentals.. I want to be more then just a 'hack', I guess..

Anyway, I'll be applying to the Rietveld in 2 weeks time, which is an art school in Amsterdam.. So.. Wish me luck.

Cross-train yourself. From the start I did this and it has allowed me to work in any area of design I choose.

As to what should you do about getting that job.

The times are calling for a new outlook on careers. There are NONE. Create your own "career".

you hit the nerve with this one, armin... i am currently wondering how to proceed with my own career and this topic i must say is timely. =)

i've been working as a webdesigner for the past four years and now i want to take on "print" moving forward. as much as i dont want to admit it, i virtually dont know anything of significance about the medium. how do you think i should proceed? i work for a firm wherein we take on virtually every project that is made available to us be it electronic, print or environmental but the personnel involved in completing these projects are divided into groups..one for print, another for electronic, and still another for motion graphics. should i go beg the guys from print to teach me? would they even be willing to?

during the dotcom bubble i used to think that print was a dying medium. now i am ashamed of my past cockiness.

> how do you think i should proceed?

>i virtually dont know anything of significance about the medium.

That could be a good start. Get some books on basic principles of printing. Begginer level (there is nothing wrong in that) so you can get familiar with the terms and processes. You already know how to design, you'll just have to learn how to apply those principles to print, which can only be done with practice.

Never trust the screen, print everything you do.

>should i go beg the guys from print to teach me? would they even be willing to?

Well, that's always hard. Imagine a print designer coming to you and asking you to teach them web design, it's kind of a tough request. It would be better if you hang around them, see how they do what they do. Do your own stuff and when you have a question ask them for help. If you are more specific with them as to what you need they'll be able to give you better feedback.

It's also important to face the fact that you sort of have to start from the bottom, so you might want to do some production work on your company's print projects to start getting the hang of it. That's how I learned web design, by optimizing hundreds of images.